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Extension of tetration to other branches - Printable Version +- Tetration Forum (https://math.eretrandre.org/tetrationforum) +-- Forum: Tetration and Related Topics (https://math.eretrandre.org/tetrationforum/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Mathematical and General Discussion (https://math.eretrandre.org/tetrationforum/forumdisplay.php?fid=3) +--- Thread: Extension of tetration to other branches (/showthread.php?tid=373) Pages:
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Extension of tetration to other branches - mike3 - 10/24/2009 Hi. I was wondering: what happens if one tries to extend the tetration to its other branches in the complex numbers, and build up the Riemann surface? Consider, for example, the regular tetration for bases where is the fixed point or limit as the tower goes to infinity over the integers. (see this thread) Let us now consider what is happening with the above formula. The portion for the continuation around the lowest (logarithmic) order (i.e. logarithmic) singularities. By extension of this idea, we see the next log in generates the singularities of the next higher logarithmic order (i.e. double logarithmic), and we can say We can continue on further, and we obtain, for a general finite integer sequence where we define and One thing of note here is that on some of these other branches, points that were singularities on the principal branch may not be so on these. Consider, for example, the branch Graphs of individual branches did not seem very interesting. Many appear "flatter" than the principal branch, interestingly (except, of course, for those obtained as There is one more property I thought worth mentioning. The formulas are given for finite sequences of integers only. By the limit process, we could define it for infinite sequences, which would generate uncountably many new values. However I am not sure whether or not these points could be truly thought of as values of tetration, because there appear to be certain theorems (see this sci.math newsgroup posting and thread I had a few months ago) that say the analytic continuation of a complex function to a multivalued function must produce only countably many values: presumably, the resulting "Riemann surfaces" from that limit procedure would contain disconnected elements (all the uncountably many sheets we just added), and so could not be interpreted as the result of analytic continuation of RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - bo198214 - 10/24/2009 (10/24/2009, 08:27 AM)mike3 Wrote: The formulas are given for finite sequences of integers only. By the limit process, we could define it for infinite sequences, which would generate uncountably many new values. However I am not sure whether or not these points could be truly thought of as values of tetration, because there appear to be certain theorems (see this sci.math newsgroup posting and thread I had a few months ago) that say the analytic continuation of a complex function to a multivalued function must produce only countably many values: ... Now that I read your article I revised my view on the number of branches, as there is an error contained in it which probably also Daniel Geisler was incorporating. I described my previous belief and the error in it here. Applied to your model of branches in the limit formula I would just guess that the limit formula does not converge if you choose infinitely man branches different from the main branch. RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - mike3 - 10/24/2009 (10/24/2009, 09:54 AM)bo198214 Wrote: Applied to your model of branches in the limit formula I would just guess that the limit formula does not converge if you choose infinitely man branches different from the main branch. Actually it does seem to converge. The problem is that it seems to converge to the same value for every z in such cases. I.e., converging to a constant function. There are uncountably many such limit values, yet as constant functions they are "analytically incompatible" (is that a real term?) with the function (you can't analytically continue a constant function to tetration!), so they cannot be interpreted as connected Riemann sheets or Riemann branches, and thus not as values of the tet function. I'm not sure of a proof though that this is actually what happens, but some way or another, it has to fail. RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - bo198214 - 10/24/2009 (10/24/2009, 08:01 PM)mike3 Wrote: Actually it does seem to converge. The problem is that it seems to converge to the same value for every z in such cases. I.e., converging to a constant function. Interesting! Quote: There are uncountably many such limit values, yet as constant functions they are "analytically incompatible" (is that a real term?) with the function (you can't analytically continue a constant function to tetration!) Well, each constant fixed point of b^x is a tetration! I.e. it satisfies c(z+1)=b^c(z). Does it converge to fixed points? RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - mike3 - 10/25/2009 (10/24/2009, 08:13 PM)bo198214 Wrote:(10/24/2009, 08:01 PM)mike3 Wrote: Actually it does seem to converge. The problem is that it seems to converge to the same value for every z in such cases. I.e., converging to a constant function. Hmm. Sounds like it's time for a graph... I'll see if I can prepare a 2D one looking at the values of various branches on the real axis (can't do 3D with anything I've got). (10/24/2009, 08:13 PM)bo198214 Wrote:Quote: There are uncountably many such limit values, yet as constant functions they are "analytically incompatible" (is that a real term?) with the function (you can't analytically continue a constant function to tetration!) But it's a constant function, so it cannot be interpreted as analytic continuation of the specific function RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - bo198214 - 10/25/2009 (10/25/2009, 02:14 AM)mike3 Wrote: But it's a constant function, so it cannot be interpreted as analytic continuation of the specific function Yes you are right, its no more the regular tetration. Can you say which branch sequence you used to produce the constant function? Quote:As you can see above, though, if we interpret it in a multivalued sense, that values on some branches of Indeed I noticed that interpretation already in other contexts. If you have a multivalued function satisfying a certain functional equation it satisfies this equation only if you choose the suitable branches. Easiest example is log with the functional equation log(ab)=log(a)+log(b). I remember also this kind of description in [Kuzma: iterative functional equations] for regular holomorphic Abel functions. Particularly I noticed this behaviour with Dmitrii's superlog, and now you add regular tetration. RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - mike3 - 10/25/2009 (10/25/2009, 07:43 AM)bo198214 Wrote:(10/25/2009, 02:14 AM)mike3 Wrote: But it's a constant function, so it cannot be interpreted as analytic continuation of the specific function I tried code will work. E.g. I suspect the Riemann surface has a interesting nested structure. Do you agree? (10/25/2009, 07:43 AM)bo198214 Wrote: Indeed I noticed that interpretation already in other contexts. If you have a multivalued function satisfying a certain functional equation it satisfies this equation only if you choose the suitable branches. Yeah, also consider RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - bo198214 - 10/25/2009 (10/25/2009, 09:33 AM)mike3 Wrote: I tried I am still not really familiar with those disconnected Riemann surfaces. Do these constants have a meaning without those limit formulas? Something path related, infinite paths, fractal paths? RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - mike3 - 10/25/2009 (10/25/2009, 11:26 AM)bo198214 Wrote: I am still not really familiar with those disconnected Riemann surfaces. If one examines at the limit formulas, the meaning should be apparent. Each RE: Extension of tetration to other branches - bo198214 - 10/25/2009 (10/25/2009, 08:47 PM)mike3 Wrote: So an infinite path might be one way of imagining it, or the limit of infinitely many finite paths. Ya, but there are no infinite paths. Only little before I discussed that in this post. If you want to come to a branch value you need a path between two points (or a closed path). And a path between two points or a closed path can not be infinite, can it? |